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Old 06-07-2013, 09:48 AM View Post #11 (Link)
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Old 06-07-2013, 03:18 PM View Post #12 (Link)
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Originally Posted by Amour View Post
Sometimes I wonder if anyone knows any religion exists besides Christianity. These debates would be a lot more interesting if they weren't so narrowly focused.
The majority of people on this site are American or English, and thus the majority of them are most familiar with the Christian point of view on Evolution. Fact is, Islam and Judaism holds much the same stance as Christians, with the more liberal agreeing with it and accepting it and the more strict refusing to believe in it. Buddhism pretty much accepts it, and most are of the opinion that it isn't important to the Circle of Rebirth, as we don't need to understand the origins of life to accept the circle. Are we really going to bother arguing about the exact same views held by each religion? Maybe if we could get some Pagan or Shinto views on here, THAT would be interesting.

But for me, I'm quite happy to agree with Neil deGrasse Tyson on this one. 'The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.'

EDIT: And before any berates me for making a statement that they hold the same stance as Christianity, let me get it clear. They hold that Evolution is a theory that can be held alongside their own views of creationism, or at least some variety of it.
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						Last edited by lostbookworm; 06-07-2013 at 03:44 PM.
Old 06-07-2013, 03:54 PM View Post #13 (Link)
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I don't mean any offense, but it was awkward for me to read your post. You were incredibly reductive. Islam has many parallels to Christianity (and many religions are similar when you access their mythology), and sure, Judaism too. But Hinduism (and Sikhism to some extent) believe in an eternal universe, whether that is reincarnation or just cyclically spiritual (Dharma). Hinduism is especially interesting because they believe in a kind of "de-evolution" or that we have devolved.

I mean, technically it is some kind of God/spirit vs Evolution, but yes, I would expect to argue similar points from different religions. Otherwise what new points of view/histories can we learn from a debate that has grown stale with the same creation story over and over again. Debates aren't exciting or interesting to me only because there are two major view points arguing, but because you learn a lot of fantastic things along the way.

Anyway, I'm most familiar with Islam (even over Christianity) and there are many branches. For instance, it might be relevant or intriguing to know that Imams, or powerful religious leaders, still exist in some branches of Islam--I have heard the current Imam speak. They are, apparently, chosen leaders by God Himself and incapable of committing sin. Debating about the truth of that (since it's a concrete person as opposed to a passage in a book) would add some kind of complexity, I think.
 
Old 06-07-2013, 03:59 PM View Post #14 (Link)
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I usually focus on Christianity, because that's the one (as LBW said) that I'm most familiar with, particularly its criticism of science. I know next to nothing about the Muslim, Jewish, Shinto, Tao, Pagan, Hindu, etc. beliefs regarding science amongst religion, and rather than make broad assuming statements about them, I limit myself to what I know. I could always look up the answers to these questions, of course, but frankly I don't really want to put that much time into something that essentially has the goal of antagonizing mass groups of people.

For fairness sake, I guess I should also point out that I do know quite a few Christians (of varying sects) who are on board with science. A lot of them regard it in the "science is how God works" kind of way, but I'm willing to settle for that because, frankly, an acknowledgement that science isn't just the devil trying to test your faith is all I ask for. I also find nothing wrong with anyone believing in God.
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Old 06-07-2013, 04:06 PM View Post #15 (Link)
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I'm pretty much with InfinityMan on this one. I'm being restrictive and make broad statements because I'm not familiar with it. The OP specifically stated Christianity and that's the route we went. If this site was based in, say, the Middle East, I'm sure a lot more people would discuss Islam, but it isn't. I agree that there are many different view points, but we just don't know them.

It just sounded somewhat condescending the way you wrote your first post. We're not completely ignorant of other religions, but we're not experts and prefer to discuss what we are familiar with.

On the topic of Imams, it's something of a different discussion. Can some humans be more divine or spiritual than others? Should some humans have power over others because of their supposed abilities? You could even drag the Divine Right of the previous Kings of Europe into it if you wanted, or the Pope. Imams are irrelevant to the topic question, although I would appreciate that question to be brought up. Something other than Evolution for a change.
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Old 06-07-2013, 04:58 PM View Post #16 (Link)
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I believe evolution is the most logical, strongly-supported and, ultimately, believable thing in the universe.

Ergo, as a Christian, I don't believe it.

It also contradicts both the literal and the metaphorical facts that the bible communicates.

It is also about a lot more than where we came from. It's about where we're 'going' as a species, which I don't agree with either. Every spiritual bone in my spiritual body shuns that kind of stuff.
 
Old 06-07-2013, 07:25 PM View Post #17 (Link)
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I think the main reason why people are anti-evolution is because they haven't actually taken the time to study it. Evolution is change over time. It is not saying that humans descended from apes. We didn't. We descended from a common ancestor, two different species in two different directions of evolution. Also, there is proof that humans have evolved in one way or another. Just look at human skeletons. Hello, people, we used to be shorter than we are now. If you want to claim that you don't believe in the theory of evolution, take a biology class and learn about it before you make that claim.

I, for one, as a christian, don't believe in all of it. I believe in the bible. I do think it is extremely important that you know about something before you have an opinion on it.
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Old 06-07-2013, 07:30 PM View Post #18 (Link)
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If you want to claim that you don't believe in the theory of evolution, take a biology class and learn about it before you make that claim.
I believe it's not all about logic. I think the ethics/mindsets behind it/around it can have a lot to do with why people don't believe it.

And the way it's promoted really badly in some areas. I can't listen to Inward Dick Rash Richard Dawkins for more than five seconds before losing interest.
  
						Last edited by Spiders; 06-07-2013 at 07:33 PM.
Old 06-07-2013, 08:00 PM View Post #19 (Link)
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Originally Posted by Spiders View Post
I believe it's not all about logic. I think the ethics/mindsets behind it/around it can have a lot to do with why people don't believe it.

And the way it's promoted really badly in some areas. I can't listen to Inward Dick Rash Richard Dawkins for more than five seconds before losing interest.
And yet people flock to political parties despite the behavior of politicians. Even still, if people are making their judgements based on presentation, then that exposes another problem in how people think: they don't care about hard facts so long as they can have comforting lies. If you can't at least try to see the world for what it really is, you're decisions are going to affect people negatively.
 
Old 06-07-2013, 08:14 PM View Post #20 (Link)
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Originally Posted by lostbookworm View Post
I'm being restrictive and make broad statements because I'm not familiar with it.
Let's just let that would soak in for a second. "I'm making general statements about a massively intricate systems of belief that have evolved into culturally definitive mindsets, because I don't really know what I'm talking about."


I believe it's not all about logic.
Can you fill me in on what else the scientific method is about, then? Evolution isn't a way of life, it's a physical process. There's no mindset/ethics to it, there's not a board of scientists inventing it. It happens. It is a natural force. Even if you don't like the people behind it, because they think you're kind of silly, it doesn't make evolution any less believable. If you fail to accept simple logic because you think Richard Dawkins is annoying, we're in bad shape here.
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